Enhancing fertility with Dr. Grey

We discuss how:

– Medications often prevent from being able to have children
– These drugs put a heavy load on certain organs related to fertility
– Dr. Grey has helped many couples restore the balance in their body and their fertility with that
– The liver plays an important role in this process and high levels of stress can interfere with its function
– Fertility and libido are closely tied together
– The emotional component is as important as the physical one and directly impacts on the liver, spleen and kidneys
– Diet, lifestyle and acupuncture can influence these factors and help balance the reproductive organs
– Both partners are involved and the health of each one can benefit the process

Clint: Looking forward to having another chat today with Dr. Ken Grey who was on a recent episode. He’s doctor of oriental medicine. He’s also an expert in acupuncture, and he’s on staff down at Jupiter Medical Center. He also has his own private practice and he’s the host of the very popular maximum health radio show. Dr. Ken Grey welcome back.

Dr. Grey: Thank you so much for having me. This is great!

Clint: Yeah we had a chat after our last podcast and we talked about fertility. We got onto that topic and so we decided that it would be great to talk about that today. And let me just frame this in a way that would be helpful for people who are wondering if they should invest the next 30 minutes listening to this podcast.

Clint: Well, the problem with rheumatoid arthritis and family planning is that we’re often on medications that prevent us from being able to have children. And I was told when I was put on Methotrexate that family planning was not going to be something that I would be able to look forward to anytime soon. And then as I was looking at having to increase and change medications the methotrexate was going to remain in the mix so for me I was very much in dismay about my potential chances of having kids. And the same thing can happen to others listening to this might be on a biologic drug or a similar disease modifying drug. And then they have a window of opportunity where they come off the meds where they must get pregnant, and this can be stressful, and that window of opportunity is delicate as pain levels can sometimes return.

Clint: You have great effectiveness and great track record of helping people get pregnant. And I think that this is going to be really interesting to learn from you as you share with us some of the ways that you help to increase fertility with some of your patients. So why don’t you start from that point and give us some tips.

Dr. Grey: Thank you. I can only imagine how fearful that not only the diagnosis of RA but then the fact that you wouldn’t be able to procreate. Now you see your own progeny (inaudible), I mean that’s a lot to take in. So what does one do? Do you look outside of the general medicine for some answers? And I think I would encourage people where ever they are to definitely do some research, because it is out there that people do go on like yourself to have healthy children and to do very well despite these very toxic drugs. Which take a load, will put a really heavy load on certain organs which are really a big part of reproductivity. So that’s what we have to look at. We have to look at the human biological machine. We have to look at all of the things tied in to it and that how it equals fertility. And what I tell my patients is this, when you’re in balance, the body is going to do what it’s meant to do. So that’s all we have to do is bring your body back in to balance. And now that’s a different approach in saying okay I’m going to go to a fertility clinic.

Clint: Yeah totally. Because it’s not like the body, or human beings are not good at expanding our race, Right? I mean look how many people in the population growth clearly where we work by default. And so it’s about trying to just get it back to that, right?

Dr. Grey: Yeah, I mean what you’re saying is so simple, but it’s more important than people can really imagine. Because when you look at the human being down to its cellular level, it is about replication, it is about multiplication, it is about (inaudible) birth and life. So when you look at ourselves when they’re healthy they multiply, they do what they’re meant to do when they’re in balance. So we’re not much different, we’re just you know.

Clint: Yeah, live versions.

Dr. Grey: But to the contrary, if the cells and our body is not healthy, then those cells do not multiply the way they’re meant to. And they fragmented, and unhealthy, and sometimes we know there’s words for all of these. And we don’t want those diagnosis but, we do know they’re not healthy. And so we want to talk about health, and we want to talk about balance, and want to talk about the promise of achieving our deepest goals which is to have a family. I think no matter where you are most people that is what you want to do. Not just counting those that don’t, because some people do not care to have children and that’s fine.

Clint: I’ve got a few friends in Australia who never thought of step out of their careers as stand up comics when they’re as friends also. And when I have told one guy in particular we’re pregnant with our first child and all this. His only response of that’s awesome, the world is definitely underpopulated, we need more people. (inaudible). Like obviously you know because his first response is to create humour, but and then secondary he’s obviously happy for me. But generally speaking you’re 100 % right, most people…

Dr. Grey: You know I was realizing that, that is a sarcastic remark. (inaudible) coming from . That is a view that some people think we are overpopulated no we don’t. But you know this is for the people that do want to have children.

Clint: That’s right.

Dr. Grey: You know and I’m one of those people that I most, I love every one of my kids. And that I can imagine not having had them. Right now, we’re looking at a time when like we said, you have this diagnosis of RA, or you just generally are having issues with fertility. What do we do? So zeroing in on the balance, What is that? First of all, I like to think that when we have a lot of the main aspects of our bodies detox and drainage working well. I think we’ve mentioned this before that, that was a part of the system that gets shut down when we’re then diagnosed with things like RA, and other auto immune diseases is the detox and drainage. When we look at detox and drainage, we look at three main organs liver, kidneys, will count those as one, and spleen, pancreas. 3 main organs, counting the kidneys as one that have to do with detox and drainage.

Dr. Grey: Now, when those are working well generally the body is representative of beautiful health, and balance. And when they’re not, a lot of other things happen. And we’re gonna look at the liver right now, and energetic purposes of the liver is to keep the free flow of energy and blood moving. Interestingly enough, the liver Meridian energetically runs through the reproductive organs. So when we look at stress, we look at toxic substances going through the blood and to the liver. When we look at poor diets, we look at high fat diets, and high alcohol in all those things. And then we look at libido, we can see how there is a connection, right? Stress levels go up, cortisol levels go up, sex drive goes down, (inaudible). Now how does that have to do with fertility? Well, sex drive is part of that first stage, it’s the body’s way of knowing that it’s ready and prepared for the act of procreation, right? So fertility and libido are very much tied together.

Clint: Interesting, that’s very interesting. Because certainly we’ve had no problem with libido, and no problem with having babies. So I’ve personally seen that correlation very much in my little sample of one. But it’s just interesting to hear you say that. So, Okay great. I’m enjoying this so far.

Dr. Grey: Yeah. So at some point it is so simple it makes sense, because that’s really what nature wants (inaudible) to be simple. We’re the ones that complicate it.

Paddison Program

Get the Paddison Program

Clint: Dr Grey, this is interesting. I’ve forgotten about this but now I want to, you’ve enlightened me on this. But when I was in a very bad way, and I was on methotrexate, and I was in a lot of pain. It was the first time in my life where I had did have very low libido, and I hadn’t really reflected on that until now. During the time I remember, you know not having interest in that. And then I’d not as I said reflected on that until now, and now you’ve enlightened me on that. I can see the black and white compared to today, and at that time. It was like it just disappeared, my body said look, you’re not in a state to go and create another human being.

Dr. Grey: And you know what’s interesting though, is it took a lot for you to sort of connect with your body what was going on. Women, more than men are always connected, they’re always sensitive to the emotional component and how it has to do with their physical existence as a whole. They have to do in every month, they have to deal with that with every situation. They are constantly (inaudible) physical roller coaster. So when you had diseases or let’s call it Syndrome’s, because they’re combination of diagnosis tied together. Like fibromyalgia, to name one of the many of these syndromes floating out there. Where at first, doctors would say you’re just crazy, you need a psychologist. Because we don’t anything physically wrong with you. But they are not able to see that the emotional component is very real, very much as real as a physical component. And now, it’s is just now that conventional medicine is catching up to that. Realization that the emotion and the gut you know which is the liver, spleen, kidneys, you know are just tracked in a bacteria (inaudible) processes in the liver. All of these things have a lot to do, it’s like a whole other brain besides what’s happening in your head, and what’s happening your gut are just as important.

Clint: Yeah.

Dr. Grey: Right? And also, it has a lot to do with your ability to be fertile. (inaudible) liver (inaudible) site, we know that the energy has to be flowing freely. We know that energy and blood are tied together, without energy to move blood, blood doesn’t move. So meridians and the blood flow pathways of the arteries, and capillaries, and veins all of those things are very much tied together in traditional Chinese medicine. So like I said deliver pathways right to reproductive organs, (inaudible) chest and that’s why women we see this energetic blockage every month when they’re out of balance. They have cramps, lower abdominal distension, breast distention, same pathway. The ovaries mirror their breasts they feel a lot of blockage there, they feel out of blockage here. Once you get a blockage away and move it away, you get the balance of the liver, spleen, kidneys. A lot of women, a lot of my patients anyways, don’t even know the period is other way that menstrual cycle is here. Sometimes they will just out of (inaudible) and will come and said this is unheard of. I’ve always had painful, as I’ve always (inaudible) have always had this, but when they get treated acupuncture, diets, so forth and so on, exercise, good rest, juicing so forth. They have their menstrual cycle is a whole different picture.

Clint: Can we just like park our main dialogue for a moment and just explore that just a little further? I know there’s exceptions and so forth, but would you generally say that it is possible for a monthly cycle to be quite painless?

Dr. Grey: In a lot of times if you think about conventional medicine when you have infertility, there are more times and not is a history of painful periods, endometriosis, cysts, fibroids, all of those things. So we look at those actual manifestations of blockages over time become mass. Energy blockages over time are blockages of blood, blockages of blood flow, become blockages of mass. Fibrosis, endometriosis, that all it is, chronic blockages. Reproductive system and reproductive organs in areas tied to the blockages and irregularities of liver. Now when you look at hormones, alcohol, cigarettes smoking starting in the teens. So you have a very strong hormones of birth control, alcohol, cigarette smoking. All those having to be filtered to the liver causing imbalances, causing these.

Clint: Good, because I was just about to ask you and this episode’s we’re just gonna be freewheeling this whole thing, because I don’t have a lot of expertise in this area, so I’m as curious as our audience here. I want to ask you; do you see that it tends to be a little more challenging for females who’ve been on birth control for a long time then come off it to then fall pregnant? And if it is the case, is it because of what you’ve just explained to create a liver imbalance because of the relationship between the birth control and the liver?

Dr. Grey: I mean there is a lot of reasons but that is one. And again I don’t even, you know there may be some. Maybe parents or individuals out there that are trying now listening to this saying well I never smoke, I never drink. But let’s look at diet, let’s look at congenital deficiencies. Parents, did they have poor liver condition? Did you have a lot of other things that you had to take as a child in the drug area, for whatever reason. A drug rate which was legal, you know or not necessarily recreational but those put took its toll on the liver. So again I don’t want to harp on that but that is a very common situation. We have birth control for very long periods of time, alcohol usage, caffeine is huge hard on the liver, and smoking and nicotine that sort of thing. And then doesn’t even touch on the other drugs.

Dr. Grey: So yes, absolutely. You have a liver condition which is tied to the imbalance of the reproductive organs. You have to work on the root which is the liver energy, liver condition, and the branch which is the reproductive organs. And when you do that, you were locally with acupuncture. You work and you marry it with diet, lifestyle, the healing foods which we can get into some of those healing foods which fall in line with what you did. Green diet, a lot of these foods are green base, alkalizing, so we can get in some (inaudible). When you do that lifestyle, acupuncture, remove the blockages, target blood flow, bring balance, reduce stress, you’ve got yourself a winning combination.

Dr. Grey: So when you have those cases which are very calm in these days, where they go through the whole process of IVF. They spend 25000 upwards, sometimes 3, 4, 5 times with no success. They never dealt with the root problem which was the whole system being out of balance, the blockages, and then the you know sometimes it does happens to Like I said the kidneys and the spleen, and we can talk about it as well.

Clint: Awesome, so I’m going to leave it up to you. Do you want to talk about some dietary things that can help the liver? Or do you want to talk about the spleen, and the other organs, complete our discussion? Because maybe those foods also apply to overall health and helping those other organs. Where would you like to go? What would you like to?

Dr. Grey: Now I’d like the listeners to take out their pen and pads. (inaudible). You know just because it’s such an easy tool, it’s such an inexpensive tool. We’re recording this right now in spring, no doubt it will be around for many years to come and people will find this, and that’s the digital universe for you. But I do have a book called Health and Balance to Springbok. Well I did all four seasons with a partner who is a cancer survivor, and a female, she’s great. And we brought both male female components to it, Health and balance but the spring issue is available via Amazon, so just go to Amazon. (inaudible) Kindle and it will have a lot of these dishes and food mostly of it is green based but talk about what it is. The liver in spring is the main organ, liver, gallbladder. In traditional Chinese medicine, we do not separate the liver from the gallbladder. It’s one organ, and if you look at it structurally the is just sitting there. So we want to do a nice intake of what’s available in the spring want maybe some (inaudible), some pears. Right? We want some spices, we want that falls under the anti-inflammatory. So Ginger, Carmen, Turmeric, cinnamon. Those are all things that stimulate a healthy liver. Also the ginger (inaudible) fresh ginger root, not just the powder because that help with bile, not only production but also just general metabolism digestion and all of those things. So even in reflux which is a liver, gallbladder condition, ginger root.

Dr. Grey: So also I would say from fertility, and for the liver green things like kelp, green algae and kelp. Kelp, one of the number one supplements I recommend for patients trying to get pregnant because, not only it’s gonna help the thyroid, but it ‘ s gonna help the liver. And thereby balance hormones and nourish the body in a very good way. It’s also you know a medicine good for the kidneys and adrenals.

Clint: Fabulous.

Dr. Grey: And then we’re going to go over to the family of sprouts.

Clint: Awesome, sprouts rich enzymes.

Dr. Grey: Rich on enzymes and rich in protein. Not easy to digest protein which is great. And also two other antioxidants in encapsulating chemicals which target cancer cells. So dandelion sprouts, red clover sprouts, which are packed full of amino acids. Red clover tea, I recommend even drinking the tea in the afternoon for my fertility patients instead of caffeine. You’ll notice your whole picking up.

Clint: Sensational.

Dr. Grey: (inaudible) forget about it. But if you can’t juice sprouts in the afternoon, you grab yourself a red clover tea. A wonderful flower nature made it for us, it’s a beautiful pick me up. No caffeine but you get your naturally occurring amino acid.

Dr. Grey: So to recap we’ve got your carrots, your ginger, your pears and apples and those things in the springtime. A lot of other things are naturally available there. You want your surf pungent spices, which are very good to keep detoxing going. And I think of course you want to eat a little bit lighter, as nature changes your going meaning having your diet in the winter. So now you want to lighten up, and juicing is going to be helpful for you to do that as well. Juicing is not smoothies, smoothies generally is gonna be a lot of fibers, (inaudible) with the nutrients. Juicing is taking the fiber out, you can still use it, you can bake it what have you if you don’t wanna waste. But we want to just ease the body, just give it the nutrients and let the digestion processes sort of calm down from all those rich heavy, fatty, (inaudible) foods, rich he needs and the heavy alcohol. We want to start to calm it down. You want to think light like butterflies. Right? With spring we think of flowers, and blooming, we wanna be light. Everything light is going to be a good dietary choice, even down to the use of even sugars you don’t want to have any sugars, you don’t want to have any pastries you everything just fruits, natural sugars.

Clint: Yeah.

Paddison Program

Get the Paddison Program

Dr. Grey: Another pastry is in all the baking that we did in the winter, that changes and shifts. So that allows for detox which will then affect the other organs. Which will lead to increased fertility and libido which is the spleen, pancreas, which is to the left of the liver right next door, very much connected. So we want those to work well, because when the liver is working well, spleen, pancreas not working well vice versa. The spleen, pancreas is your center for you, your spleen is your white cell, T-cells or fighter cell production site, lymph system site. It’s energetically in charge of keeping its transformation, transportation nutrients. So it is the still to the pot of soup which is your stomach. So without that if it’s not balanced, if it’s not working well, you won’t have good muscle energy, you won’t have much energy at all, you won’t be able to process what you take in and make it into the energy that you need and the blood that you need. So transforms what you take in, into energy, simple. It’s also site for keeping the lymph system in (inaudible), which is you’re to get all the toxins out.

Clint: Right. Right.

Dr. Grey: And then you’ve got your kidneys, and the kidneys are your powerhouse. It’s your site for reproduction because, it also is the house of Yin and Yang we call it. And interestingly enough on the top of the kidneys we call them adrenals, but for us it’s the house in essence. And so that is where your rich essence comes from to be able to produce beautiful, healthy children. To provided and everything’s in balance, your essence and your adrenals, are essence AKA your adrenals are strong, and you’re strong, and your energy is strong, you have a clear mind, you have a fullness. If you’re always drinking the caffeine, have a lot of alcohol going through your system, not resting enough, taking certain drugs what have you. The adrenals get depleted and your ability to produce healthy, happy, strong children is greatly diminished. And if by some chance you do lose essence through that, your ability to recover as a female is very hard.

Clint: Okay.

Dr. Grey: Levels now that we’ve gone through, a few levels of what fertility, health, detox (inaudible) and all this was and how they combine. But also you want to look at the mother, and the father, we want healthy parents. We don’t just want healthy children, because a lot of times they focus so much after going through this ordeal on the fertility. But if you’re not healthy and you have no created healthy lifestyle, a healthy household, you’re in for a whole new challenge.

Clint: Yeah. And now, how important is it for both parents to be healthy? And do you think that this is a process that both adults should be engaging in so that they can get the best possible statistical likelihood of conception?

Dr. Grey: So generally speaking, yes. I mean when you want the best outcome in something that requires a partnership, you want both partners to be equally healthy in trying their best. Now obviously we live in a world still use it more as a “female job”. I don’t feel that way as position. I love it when both partners come in, but it is still very rare.

Dr. Grey: The male (inaudible) the work, he’ll write the check and the female is the one attending and inspire herself and going through. But I think like I said it comes down to creating a healthy partnership, healthy lifestyle, healthy home, healthy children, healthy family. If any of that is off balanced and there’s gonna be some issue down the road even if there is conception.

Clint: Do you find that when you have an anxious patient, whether it be because it’s been a long time that they’ve been trying, or their partner is maybe not as interested in having a baby as they are, or their biological clock is ticking, or other reasons. That anxiety works against them, or is that not true?

Dr. Grey: No I think you’re absolutely right. Those are all reasons why patients can come in, they can sit in front of me. Some of them if they’re just starting out, it’s going to be a lot easier because they have all that weight on them, and all those challenges behind them. The more that they’ve been trying, the longer they’ve been trying, the more the relationship is sort of tested, or their health is compromised because they’ve had a lot of hormones going through their bodies. So their emotions are not what they used to be. They’ve gained weight, so their self-esteem is not what used to be. So a lot of times my job which is so different than an IVF clinic or a conventional physician in general medicine. My job is really again to look at the whole person, look at the whole situation, and restore them to where they are. A balanced healthy women first, I say we’ve got to bring you back because once we bring you back your body is gonna do what it’s supposed to do.

Dr. Grey: Right? But you can’t just be focusing on having a child because, God forbid if you just had that child right now would not be ready to be a mother. So that’s what we have to remember. And (inaudible) community that you’re helping to create (inaudible) and all that. Is that it’s about healthy families, healthy lives. Yes, achieving it all.

Clint: Yeah, I like that a lot.

Dr. Grey: (inaudible) site, because you’re just going to these places where everything’s about numbers. It’s about what they can do on paper and that’s very far from what we need.

Clint: Is there anything else or are there some more things that you would suggest to someone who may walk in and be in that scenario? They’ve tried for 18 months, they’re looking at paying a lot of money for getting the in vitro fertilization or you know whatever it’s called cause I don’t know much about it fortunately have not had to do it. And they’re worried, and they say Dr. Grey like a really really really want to get pregnant and you’ve walked through the things that you’ve already told us today with the dietary changes and so on. Is there any other things that you might like to speak to that person about who may be that sort of person listening?

Dr. Grey: I think life style, life patterns come to mind. Because everyone has you know at that stage no one wants to be told what to do, what not to do. They want to encourage to remember what makes them happy, and what was happiness, and what would be a healthy approach to things that they normally find happiness. I mean, (inaudible) once you’ve had so many needles, and so many procedures, and you’ve failed, and you have this person saying, Okay I now have what could possible be the answer. The first thing is to make that connection between, okay this is going to be teamwork. Some healthy patterns we can establish in your life. One of the first things I tell them is you got to get rid of caffeine.

Clint: That’s literally the first thing I say as well.

Dr. Grey: Which is one of the first things they look at me you know, you got to be kidding me. Because they say, I don’t drink, I don’t. Then we start to break it down, okay what are the real harmful effects? Is a glass of red wine, is that gonna hurt situations? Not necessarily in most cases.

Clint: No, yeah. But the daily coffee that’s just.

Dr. Grey: Your adrenals and your chances of reproducing after you’ve already depleted for years. (inaudible) you know this idea that there is bad and good not so much, but what’s appropriate for you? I want to bring across. That’s when I sit down with people and say, okay this is about you, there is no generalization, and it’s so different again from most procedures. Everything is just run of the mill, this is what we do, this is what works for us. I may not work for you, so let’s work at your issue. This other the thing to, is after years of like you said even dealing with RA and some of the medications. Whether or not that may present differently with prior histories for certain patients because some may not be able to get pregnant because of blocked fallopian tubes. So then it’s an issue of circulation of blood flow.

Clint: Right. And does that where some acupuncture can come into it? If I may I want to I would love to share a short story that wholly supports this. Before you then tell us about your acupuncture approach.

Clint: My wife was with our last baby Ariel, she was due for labor on a particular day. And the day came, and I think we were just one or two days past the expecting due date. And we made inquiry about going to an acupuncturist, and we found out who people recommended some of our friends and said they were amazing and this was in Sydney. So we went to the acupuncturist, and Melissa laid down on the bed and had the needles. And then the lady just said, this is going to be huge. I can just sense that this is going to have a profound effect. And I’ve only occasionally over the last 10 years, witnessed acupuncture or had it myself. So not very dialed in to its profound effectiveness. And Melissa just started crying so much, she was just started bawling out of nowhere. And the practitioner said this is what you need to go through, this is the result. It didn’t hurt it was that she was releasing, and I bet you know where this is going. But after the treatment we got her, back into the car she felt a lot better, and lo and behold by about 4pm that afternoon contractions began, just like that. And I mean you know I’m always wanting to say, well skeptic could be a coincidence. But this was like profound for her. And so I just want to put that little story in people’s minds as you now begin to talk about the acupuncture side of things here.

Dr. Grey: We want precision, we want individualize, we want you know consideration for us as people not just the symptom or the diagnosis. So many little areas to look at, there so many little. What do you call that English muffins?

Clint: All of the nuances, right?

Dr. Grey: And you really have to be clear on that, because like I said I just touched on one aspect of what infertility can be. Which is like the fallopian tubes being blocked. Or what about someone presents and they’re very skinny, and they have lost a lot of weight, and they kept on our way. And you say, oh maybe the spleen-pancreas has been, you know their diet, maybe they ate a lot of salads, and did lot of exercise and overwork. And they’re just, a lot of antibiotics because they were always you know having colds, or travel a lot from work. So, you can’t just say I’m just going to do this procedure and fix it. No, we’ve got to get some work, so they can put on some weight because of the body senses there’s not enough extra to go around, it’s not going to make another life. It’s simple.

Dr. Grey: So the 1st step is not to get her pregnant, I’m not going to say oh we’re going to help increase your chances of you know. Even with or without IVF being a part of the picture, this is not going to work right now because you are malnourished. You don’t have enough with you, we need to fix your ability to digest, and process foods, and get your strength back. And then you have some people that are just high stress. What do you do issues we’re there, anxious, not sleeping, heart palpitations, anxiety? They’re taking depression meds, and anxiety meds. That has to be dealt with.

Dr. Grey: So all these things at play in to, not just the history of auto immune disease, but all the things that went around the auto immune disease. Be it the depression. So you’ve got to bring them from the root, to the branch, and show them, and tell them, and they have to look for that. And I would urge everyone to look into that and start to ask those types of questions. I don’t want to just see what you can do on paper, on a petri dish, on a machine. I want to know how you’re going to make me better and make me the mother that I’m supposed to be. So child then I have in me, that’s waiting to come.

Clint: They’re very wholesome words, aren’t they? Mother, family, health, balance. I mean these words encompass so much that’s why someone who is practicing the way that you do has such a difficult job, because you are looking at all of the extremity issues that exist. And have to almost just reach out and dial each one of them back to center again. And you don’t know what’s going to be the problems of the next person walking in the door. But what you’ve got to do is you’ve got to find the unique, and bespoke ways in which you can get them back into balance. So we can as you said at the beginning of this conversation, allow their body to then do the magic of falling pregnant, the way that it’s designed to do that magic itself.

Dr. Grey: Agreed.

Paddison Program

Get the Paddison Program

Clint: It must be very satisfying when you’ve helped someone fall pregnant. What does that feel like?

Dr. Grey: Well now I ‘ve done it enough that I can work in a public place, or an outing, and have a teenager walk up to me. And their parents behind them and say, remember me? And the parents behind them going you know pointing.

Clint: Awesome.

Dr. Grey: So it’s years now, doing it (inaudible). When you have people that stopped you, or still hug you years later and say, thank you for giving us a family. Or when that child can say that you’re the reason I’m here, which of course this just how it’s translated to them. But I don’t think that too much to head. The heart is the privilege of having created a healthy family, and again these outings to that means that they are doing things together. These are not people that I can say I didn’t do the fullness of my job, which is to create a balanced situation. No I don’t stop it, like I said just the conception. I really start with the conversation. I let them know it’s a good place if they want to cry like you said or laugh. It’s a safe place, and it’s something that I’m looking to help all of them.

Clint: Someone just popped their head in behind me. But we were used to that here in this Paddison household everyone’s part of our family operation. Well it is such a enjoyable thing to talk about. I have a lot of fun talking about this, and you know the level of variety that exists from person to person is so great we can’t cover every possible scenario. But what if someone wants to reach out to you who is not in your local area. Do you do Skype consultations to help people who might be international or in a different state? And what’s the best way for people to reach out for you in general?

Dr. Grey: I mean, I think it can be g in easily with an email, drken@drkengrey.com .. I think also social media is helpful, people do reach out to me through Instagram, doc ken grey, or Facebook doc ken. And of course, phone call, 561-746-7300 is great. And as I mentioned, I will definitely, I have a few books out that they can download.

Clint: For sure most definitely. Off line I’ll have you email me each of the links to your books, particularly the ones relevant to this I’ll put at the top. Particularly the one you mentioned earlier, the spring one.

Dr. Grey: That’s when all of nature is procreates. It seems appropriate that we’re having this conversation now. Is this the 1st day of spring?

Clint: I couldn’t say our day of recording today. What are we today? It’s the 21st of March as we record this at the moment. But most people will be listening to this at some point in the future as we edit it, and get it live. And then of course, people like to sometimes go through and download all the history and go through one at a time and that could be happening any time.

Dr. Grey: It’s not the actual day I think we’re fairly close, but if it is I feel very. I think it’s serendipitous that we’re having this conversation.

Clint: Absolutely. It’s certainly a glorious day here, so we’re very lucky. And I feel very grateful to be able to learn from you today Dr. Grey. Thanks for coming back and sharing your time with us again. If you want to go ahead and go to www.paddisonprogram.com and find this episode on there you just simply click on www.paddisonprogram.com/blog and you’ll find all the history of all of our podcast episodes. Type in Dr. Ken Grey or Dr. Grey. And his episodes, including this one will show up and you’ll be able to get all the show notes and just click through the links from there.

Clint: Thank you very much. This has been very interesting.

Clint Paddison

Clint Paddison has recovered from crippling Rheumatoid Arthitis and now assists others with this disease via the Paddison Program for Rheumatoid Arthritis, the Paddison Podcast and the blogs on www.paddisonprogram.com